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JDRF, Animas & Dexcom Artificial Pancreas development Pact

Discussion in 'Parents of Children with Type 1' started by badshoe, Jan 13, 2010.

  1. badshoe

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  2. zimbie45

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  3. BrokenPancreas

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    That is great, so is Dr. Faustman and Smart Insulin.
    Everything is always "years away" though:(:(
     
  4. hawkeyegirl

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    How does this work, exactly? My understanding of the JDRF's involvement in the AP project so far was that any technology developed with JDRF funds would be made available to all companies, either through licensing or that it would just be "public" (non-patented) technology. Now you have JDRF partnering with J&J to create a for-profit product. Interesting. (Especially because although I cannot remember the exact position he holds with either entity, I believe one of the directors or majority shareholders of J&J holds a position on the JDRF board of directors.)
     
  5. Sarah Maddie's Mom

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    Ok - if I'm understanding this correctly, it means that $8 million in hard found JDRF funds will be used to advance the R&D efforts of a for-profit company, and in 4 years may provide us with an integrated pump and CGM which will require 1 infusion set insertion and a second sensor insertion and one or two remote devices ... which we and or our insurance companies will buy from the above mentioned company? This integrated system will make basal rate adjustments to some extent on it's own. But we will still be manually bolusing for meals. And will we be actively treating lows requiring carbs? Or is the wizard in the machine supposed to prevent ALL lows? And JDRF is along for the ride, why? Because the market doesn't sustain this R&D, or because they stand to gain in some material way, or because this is how they think we want our donations spent?


    I'm confused.
     
  6. BrokenPancreas

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    My daughter uses the Navigator and soon will be using the Minimed.

    The article says it will be Dexcom and Animas.

    Just thinking out loud..
     
  7. hawkeyegirl

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    I wouldn't worry. By the time the miracle product comes out, both your pump and CGM will be out of warranty, and you can upgrade for free. ;)

    As an edit to my post above, it is Woody Johnson who is "heir to the J&J fortune" and who is chairman of the board of directors for JDRF. I think I'm pretty appalled by that.
     
  8. joy orz

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    I just finished reading "Diabetes Rising" by Dan Hurley - there were some threads about his NPR interview recently.

    Anyway, he was a test subject for the Minimed cloosed loop system. He talks about the experience in the book. He felt very positive about the experience and is greatly looking forward to the day when this becomes a reality.

    While an artificial pancreas is not a cure, reading a t1's experience with it, made me very optimistic that it will be a major development in quality of life for our kiddos.

    (On a side note, if you haven't read it yet, the book is good. Starts off as a major downer with theories on the rise of new cases, but then gets to the good part about treatment options, new technology and cure research. If you get through the first half, you'll be uplifted in the second half.)
     
  9. moco89

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    The self-adjusting pump with cgms will certainly not be a closed loop system, because the sensors available have to be able to sense 6x faster than the rise in glucose.

    At least as much "user intervention" will be required as now, especially in the earliest versions of this self-adjusting pump.

    And no, I do not consider this research. I consider it "product development"(!). But, I guess it's for a good cause.....

    Remember that the AP has only been testing in controlled settings, such as in the hospital with controlled amounts of carbs and activity.
     
  10. badshoe

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    From the end of the release, "JDRF's goal is to have multiple versions of an artificial pancreas available for people with diabetes; the organization will continue to explore partnerships with other industry leaders."

    Like JDRF?s IDDP I think there is sound reason for folks to wonder why JDRF works with for profits. I have spent some time over the last few years talking to JDRF. They have been clear, the idea is to bridge breakthrough in the lab to services in the market that PWD can use to live better lives.

    JDRF is involved in a number of agreements with for profits. I would love more transparency but to be honest a few of the IDDP agreements have been in the for profit's 10K financial statements and they are not light reading.

    I don't know if this is structured like an IDDP. If it is then JDRF stands to see returns form the commercialization of the product.

    I don't see type 1 research as cure or nothing. I think there are incremental technologies that hold great promise to improve the standard of living for people with diabetes.



    My 2007 bit on IDDP is here
     
  11. hawkeyegirl

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    Yeah, I have no real problem with JDRF using money to develop new technology, in addition to funding going towards finding a cure. I do have a problem with the clear conflict of interest in this particular partnership. I'm frankly astounded that JDRF can keep their tax-exempt status while so blatantly contributing to the profits of a specific public corporation. (Especially with the obvious, obvious connection between the two.)
     
  12. Toni

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    It is JDRF's ties to J&J and Animas that I question. JDRF should partner with ALL the pump companies re AP development. Though I do remember some very old promising research about the noninvasive implanted cgms Animas had been working on, that I have heard nothing about since J&J took over Animas. Maybe Animas has been working on this implantable sensor and it is farther along, causing JDRF to partner with J&J? I am hoping there is a good reason......
     
  13. Flutterby

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    This is the connection that I have a real problem with too.. The fact that the heir to J&J is (or was) the CEO to JDRF is a real problem to me.. HUGE in fact.. I don't have a problem with JDRF helping to develope the AP, but it shouldn't be based on one company and certaintly NOT the ONE company where the CEO is the heir to the company it a partner with.. wrong, just so wrong.:mad:
     
  14. BrokenPancreas

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    Yea, but I love the Navigator, I wish they went with them.
    That monitor is scary accurate!:D

    Don't know about Minimed, haven't dealt with it yet
     
  15. badshoe

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    My understanding is that implantable device didn't develop to promise.

    What Toni is really getting to is the fear of a promising technology being squashed to protect other revenue streams. The extreme case being, "the strip companies will not allow a cure to market."

    The issue is that getting from promising idea in a lab to product that can get past FDA is a long costly road. The costs of that process may keep viable technologies from making it to market. JDRF stepping in and helping get products to market is fine with me as long as there is a method for JDRF to recapture that investment after a product is successfully commercialized.

    JDRF has a mechanism in the IDDP program is that, should an IDDP partner choose not to bring a technology that JDRF has helped finance to market then JDRF has the right to bring that intellectual property to market with others.

    When I first heard of JDRF's IDDP program I was concerned that JDRF was acting as an investment bank and that there were potential conflicts of interest inherent in that kind of activity. So much so that I called and had some fairly lengthy conversations. JDRF does have what I considered to be strong conflict of interest policies.

    Scott S. left a particularly good comment on YDMV some time ago on this he said:

     
  16. hawkeyegirl

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    So it's a coincidence that there's such a strong, top-heavy connection between JDRF and J&J? From Sarah's post on the other thread:

    The AP is not something that wouldn't happen without JDRF's involvement. And I don't know how it is advanced by forming a partnership with one manufacturer, as opposed to doing what it has been doing, and working with all of them. So good news for Animas and Dexcom, I guess, and bad news for Insulet, Abbott, and Medtronic. I'm glad I know where my JDRF dollars are (were) going.
     
  17. Beach bum

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  18. Toni

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    Minimed has invested tons of money in cgms and AP development. For JDRF to choose J&J and their Animas pump alone, instead of working with the other pump companies as well..... I didn't get it. After reading the other posts, I do. It's political. I don't for a moment believe Researchers are not going to continue to look for a cure for Type 1. But they will need grants and funding for their research.
     
  19. buggle

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    Don't forget that Lewis, the current CEO of JDRF, was also the CEO of Novocell -- the company working on Smart Insulin.

    It seems that JDRF is redefining a cure to mean very expensive products vs basic research. The JDRF funded scientists who sit on the funding panels can keep their labs going and funded by following the status quo (product development) rather than taking risks and doing innovative research. There's inherent bias in the results of researchers who are funded by corporations and it's an ongoing issue and the subject of study for ethics and integrity in medical research. We all lose when profits for large corps win out over progress in science.
     
  20. moco89

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    Honestly, all of the companies have received money. But, no matter what, there is a conflict of interest. It need not be proven.

    If the JDRF was being prudent and astute regarding its funding and partnerships (and also the people who served on these boards) this issue would of never been mentioned. The organization and the board members are guilty by association. But, as a non-profit, they are not being as forthcoming about a lot of things, including the "Artificial Pancreas" itself, when you ignore the unscrupulous business relationships.

    The "self-adjusting pump", which they like to call an "automated insulin pump" that acts as a VERY LIMITED facet of an artificial pancreas, will never have the capabilities of being a stable "closed loop system". It will likely require as much user intervention and judgement as a user currently uses, and will only work efficiently under controlled settings.

    As far as I'm concerned, the JDRF and its contributors are blindly funding a product development project. If the JDRF was truly interested in creating a "closed loop" and stable control system, they would work on the process systematically, by first developing the sensors and insulin delivery methods needed to maintain a stable loop. That is the single critical element to making the AP work. We already have the mathematical formulas derived to make the project work, believe it or not.

    We also never hear of any disclosure regarding the constraints or the limits, that prevent the possibility of a closed loop in the first place. That is plain wrong, and is not prudent on their part.

    I also have some close, very smart electical/computer engineering major friends, who are about to graduate. Electrical/computer engineers are the specialists that design and create the algorithms that make the "closed loop" work. This career is the specialty that makes controlled systems work! My upperclassmen friends agree that the "closed loop" strategy is not viable with the current technology available.

    I think the JDRF needs to get its priorities straight, because their lack of disclosure and conflicts of interest will catch up with them.
     
    Last edited: Jan 13, 2010

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