- advertisement -

531...and I don't trust the Ketostix

Discussion in 'Parents of Children with Type 1' started by Suessigkeit, May 30, 2012.

  1. momandwifeoftype1s

    momandwifeoftype1s Approved members

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2008
    Messages:
    3,185
    If the child was tested just after arriving at school, I'm guessing that insulin was still on board to cover the carbohydrates consumed. It would not be unexpected for blood sugars to be elevated with no ketones. It's happened with my child. I would hate for the school nurse/TDMP at his school to feel like I was not being truthful; or worse, negligent. People who don't have a child with diabetes really have no idea how difficult it is to manage this disease no matter how many credentials are listed after his or her name. My gut reaction to this OP was that I felt completely insulted that someone caring for my child could question my ability to care for my child based on one high blood sugar reading.

    This is exactly why Connor's health care plan does not allow school to test ketones. I would immediately come get him and test ketones myself if my son threw up at school. Also, I am notified by phone of any numbers over 350 and I can decide a course of action depending on the situation. Sometimes I come get him if he's symptomatic/ie feeling ill. Sometimes it just to follow the sliding scale and push water. It's so important to have open communication between school staff and the parents.
     
  2. sooz

    sooz Approved members

    Joined:
    Dec 4, 2009
    Messages:
    2,330
    I think the sad fact is, some parents are negligent and we are all capable of making mistakes. I would appreciate the feedback if someone had a question about an unusual situation. Hailey recenty had her first experience since Dx with high ketones and vomiting. I was a nervous all day until it resolved in the late afternoon after lots of insulin and fluids. There is a current thread about mistakes people have made, and I know those parents are diligent. I think we would all be appalled if we knew some of the horrible stuff school nurses have to deal with. I know I would be grateful if a nurse caught a mistake I had made.
     
  3. momandwifeoftype1s

    momandwifeoftype1s Approved members

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2008
    Messages:
    3,185
    My son's medical staff at school have my written permission to contact his pediatric endocrinologist for assistance with diabetes related issues while he is at school. If the school nurse/TDMP need a 2nd opinion, they can contact the doctor's office. I would hope someone taking care of my son's medical care would seek out the assistance of his endo instead of searching online forums for advice.
     
  4. caspi

    caspi Approved members

    Joined:
    Oct 11, 2006
    Messages:
    5,134
    I agree - some parents ARE negligent. I think the issue at hand here is that this school employee came on to a public website and was very judgmental at the supposed lack of care this child was receiving. She was very detailed in her description. IMO, HER comments were appalling.
     
  5. swellman

    swellman Approved members

    Joined:
    Jul 30, 2008
    Messages:
    3,544
    Well, you can be appalled at me as well because it seems the child should have never been dropped off at school IMO. Why would someone correct with a pump and give an extra unit via pen unless they thought the pump site was compromised? And they came back to get her which is proof positive she shouldn't have been there. What 11 year old is solely responsible for correcting before bed and at breakfast without parental oversight? The OP called her self-sufficient but it sounds more like left on her own to manage.

    The question was about the ketones anyway.
     
  6. mmgirls

    mmgirls Approved members

    Joined:
    Nov 28, 2008
    Messages:
    6,030
    .................................
     
  7. Lee

    Lee Approved members

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2006
    Messages:
    9,633
    I HAVE dropped my kid off at school with a high blood sugar and no ketones. I think almost all of us has.

    They came to get her after she threw up. Who knows why she threw up - the OP thinks it was ketones - but multiple ketone tests say they where negative.

    And honestly, when I talk to my child's school, it is the facts - just the facts. I never give details about her being high all weekend, when we changed sites, when she missed boluses, her spending multiple nights at friends, or what she ate for breakfast, or even how I - her parent - choose to correct her. Why would I?

    Swellie, let me ask - do you tell your school nurse all that info? Hmmm?
     
  8. swellman

    swellman Approved members

    Joined:
    Jul 30, 2008
    Messages:
    3,544
    Actually, yes. I share nearly everything with her ... highs, why and what we did - lows, why and what we did. A1c's and what the endo said and how I feel about that. I share pump issues and how we resolved them. I share pod failures and my speculations as to why and how we resolved them. I share how we addressed theme park issues and parties and cakes and multiple grazing issues. I share with her our mistakes and our victories. I share because she cares and is interested. She's more than willing to listen and ask questions and learn to be a better care giver.

    We live in a tornado zone and not too many miles from a nuclear reactor and, because of the reasons above, I feel perfectly comfortable that if she were to have to care for him over an extended period of time I know she will keep him safe and healthy. We respect her and we have a great relationship. EDIT: It's a partnership.

    I have not sent my son to school with BGs anywhere near 500's or 400's and I'm pretty sure not near 300's unless it's a food spike. And most certainly not uncorrected for something like 12 hours and after eating waffles with high BGs. I wouldn't do that to our nurse or our school. Maybe that's just me.
     
  9. Sarah Maddie's Mom

    Sarah Maddie's Mom Approved members

    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2007
    Messages:
    12,521
    I reiterate.

    It was all the unnecessary and vaguely judgmental and presumptive content in the OPs first thread that got my attention. Perhaps it is possible for some to read her OP as simply seeking information, but I read it as presuming that the mom was lying about ketones, had allowed her child to have an excessive weekend and then, god forbid, allowed her to eat waffles.

    The tone of the thread implied that the poster was rescuing the child and that though the ketostix were reading negative, that she, the aide was right, the mom and the ketostix were wrong.

    I found that to be overstepping the lines, or rather my line, of what I would want my kid's aide to do. To each their own.
     
  10. swellman

    swellman Approved members

    Joined:
    Jul 30, 2008
    Messages:
    3,544
    Perhaps I assume too much but I doubt you would not check and correct before bed and before breakfast and then, god forbid, let your child eat a high carb breakfast with BGs soaring into the 500's and then drop them off at school complaining of stomach pains so ... it confuses me why you would react as if this were personal to you or why you would come to the defense of the unknown mother when you know nothing of the situation other than what the OP put in her post. I get that it bothered you and others but I don't get why and I guess the thread has already been derailed due in no small part of mine so I'll just go with it-is-what-it-is.
     
  11. Sarah Maddie's Mom

    Sarah Maddie's Mom Approved members

    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2007
    Messages:
    12,521
    Fwiw, I'm not coming to anyone's defense. But you hit part of the nail on part the head.

    I know nothing of this mother, this child, this aide. I don't know zip about the truth of any of this scenario. It could all be made up for all I know. I'm simply saying that she had a fairly simple question, "Can expired ketostix give a false negative?" A simple question which need not have been couched in a very, to my mind, judgmental post full of :eek::eek::(:(

    I think we'll not see eye-to-eye on this so I'll refrain from any further comments on the matter.
     
  12. MamaLibby

    MamaLibby Approved members

    Joined:
    Oct 30, 2011
    Messages:
    607
    I agree!

    As for the ketones: Yes, blood is more accurate than urine. And because my daughter had a very short/ "light" honeymoon, we tend to see ketones with high BGs and illness.
     
  13. caspi

    caspi Approved members

    Joined:
    Oct 11, 2006
    Messages:
    5,134
    This was my issue with this post as well. How many times have we seen people on here that were upset over comments and judgments made by other parents and teachers that do not have a child with D? The OP is not a nurse. She is an employee of the school and the entire tone of her post, IMO, was out of line and completely unprofessional.
     
  14. eveinthesky

    eveinthesky Approved members

    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2010
    Messages:
    34
    For her to come here for help shows true concern. It sometimes can be confused with arrogance...well not really, but in your case I hope so. Yes we do struggle with our diabetic children 24/7, but that doesn't mean we need to come off with an attitude when someone is clearly seeking help.
     
  15. Lee

    Lee Approved members

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2006
    Messages:
    9,633
    Again - I agree with Sarah completely. I honestly feel that the question could have been asked in a simpler, less judgmental tone. I don't think Sarah came across as arrogant, but I do think the initial post sounded arrogant.

    As a parent, I would hate to read that post and think it was about my kid. I am allowed to think that way, and Sarah is allowed to think that way, and you are allowed to think that she is a Saint. End of story.
     
  16. Sarah Maddie's Mom

    Sarah Maddie's Mom Approved members

    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2007
    Messages:
    12,521
    LOL, not sure what the hell this means - but whatever- if you want to celebrate this sort of thing have at it- I could care less. ;)
     
  17. MommaKat

    MommaKat Approved members

    Joined:
    Sep 2, 2011
    Messages:
    646
    Was going to reply to the OP via private message but realized this might be good info for more than just the OP. There are three by products of fat metabolism that are referred to collectively as ketones. One of these three, the one most likely to accumulate in diabetics, is actually not measured by the urine ketostix, but is measured by blood ketone meters. So, not only can expired ketostix yield false negatives, so too can in date ketostix. We now have a blood ketone meter at school in case we cannot get to dd quickly enough.

    I don't know where the OP resides, but the default 504 / IHP plan for type I diabetics on a pump in Colorado state that BG > 250 with vomiting or stomach pain the aide or nurse must contact the parent to pick up the child from school as further medical evaluation or closer care by parent is warranted. (After all of the strife we encountered over getting her 504 and having it adhered to, we discovered there is a state generic plan schools are supposed to start with. Nice to find, and a great resource.) I can understand the OPs concern, and know that when I'm posting out of concern and feeling nervous about what dd is contending with, my posts can sound emotional which readers here construe or interpret however they choose - OPs have no control over that.

    FWIW, over the course of the year, and as a result of the difficulties we encountered with the school, we reached a point where we are fairly open and share most aspects of D with our school's aide. She needed the extra info or occasional blow by blow to better understand how to help dd manage. It was a growing, learning experience on both sides. I applaud any aide who seeks out better, further understanding of D and how to help students manage while in school.
     
  18. caspi

    caspi Approved members

    Joined:
    Oct 11, 2006
    Messages:
    5,134
    I don't think anyone is saying that caregivers shouldn't seek out information to better, further their understanding of D. However the manner in which this caregiver went about it (originally listing each child's initials and info on whether they were pumping/mdi) and the tone of her post is not something that I would want to see if I was the parent of this child.

    Seriously think about it -- if this was YOUR child and the caregiver had made this post, how would you really feel??

    And from her previous posts, I believe the OP is from California.
     
  19. momandwifeoftype1s

    momandwifeoftype1s Approved members

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2008
    Messages:
    3,185
    You know what? That waffle comment really ticked me off. Do school staff members really need to know what my child ate for breakfast? No, they do not. I'd be happy if my child would eat a waffle for breakfast at 15 grams of carbs. Sugar free syrup on top of a Nutrigrain waffle is not a bad breakfast choice, IMO. I would let my child eat a waffle, even if he chose to eat is with a flimsy spork.

    From Calorie King: http://www.calorieking.com/foods/ca...lk-frozen-ready-to-heat_f-ZmlkPTE0NzcyOA.html

    This is what I have to say about eating waffles for breakfast. As long as they are not made with poison, I say to go for it.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UtlaTNI1TaU
     
    Last edited: Jun 3, 2012
  20. Becky Stevens mom

    Becky Stevens mom Approved members

    Joined:
    Oct 14, 2008
    Messages:
    8,719
    First of all, kudos to you for wanting to learn more about type 1 diabetes in order to give these kids the best care possible. I think you could call a pharmacist and ask them about the Ketostix, if they can indeed fail to pick up ketones if they are far past their expiry date. Sometimes my son will get high blood sugars and not get ketones. The ketones will usually happen if the high blood sugar has been there for awhile without being corrected. Im sorry she was feeling so unwell that day:( As a Mom I get really pissed off at other parents for sending in their kids with obvious illness or if they arent feeling good. When my type 1 gets sick, he often gets very sick. So I'd rather others keep their sick kids home. I know its not always easy but only fair. And if Steven was over 500 and not feeling well, he'd be staying home. I wouldnt want to be forced to go somewhere feeling like crap and wouldnt force my kids to either
     

Share This Page

- advertisement -

  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice