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Head is SPINNING, OCR said....

Discussion in 'Parents of Children with Type 1' started by Lindy, Dec 7, 2009.

  1. Lindy

    Lindy Approved members

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    OCR rep said that it seems we are asking for "cadillac" care from the school district.... So naturally, I asked her to give me an example... She said that expecting the school staff to CARB COUNT seemed like cadillac care... She also admitted to not knowing about diabetes. Of course I tried to tell her that carb counting was considered basic, standard care for ANY STUDENT with diabetes.... She said she wasn't sure about that and that would be something that would come out in the investigation!

    Does this crap ever end?!:mad:
     
  2. Lee

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    WHAT?????? From OCR? That is insane!
     
  3. Flutterby

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    Thats absolutely ridiculous!

    Its not like you are asking for extra gym classes!
     
  4. mapoe4

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    What Lee said. I am going thru the OCR with John's school and I haven't heard that one yet.
     
  5. Sarah Maddie's Mom

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    Ok - I'm going to be the odd duck, but why does school need to count carbs? I'm not saying that they should refuse to do so, I'm just saying that carb counting is a skill that takes some time to learn and we are all motivated to get it right, but will a cafeteria aide really be so motivated?

    Maybe my perspective is skewed by the fact that Maddie has always taken her lunch and snack to school so it's been easy just to pre-count the carbs and write it on the lunch bag. And that I think the hot lunch at school would be really hard to carb count accurately, too many variable for my taste.

    Like I said, I may be the only one who feels this way. But I thought I'd just put it out there :eek: Not to say that the school is right - just that it may not be an accommodation that they've been asked before to make. :cwds:
     
  6. bgallini

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    I agree that the parent can make things easier by sending lunch with precouinted carbs or coming up with estimates for the school lunches but someone has to look at what he ate and decide if the actual carbs eaten was less than what was planned.

    I don't think that's too much to ask.

    I do agree that some things people ask for in 504 plans might seem 'cadilac like' but carb counting is basic.
     
  7. wilf

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    I send DD to school with a lunch we make every day. She has a variety of different lunches, but they all come to the same approximate carb count. That way she gets the same amount of insulin (the NPH in our case) daily.

    It might be possible for you to meet the school half-way on this, so maybe give it some thought..
     
  8. danismom79

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    Can you get a letter from your endo explaining what carb counting is, and why it's important? If she doesn't know about diabetes, how can she call anything "cadillac care"?

    My daughter also takes her lunch to school with everything labelled. I branched out this year and let her buy school lunch on occasion (because of the price, not because of her D), and the nurse calls me to either tell me the carb counts she got from the cafeteria staff, or to have me estimate everything. She'll tell me about how much of a certain item is on her tray, and I'll look it up.
     
  9. Flutterby

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    Her child is 5 years old.. if he's ANYTHING like a typical 5/6 year old, he WANTS hot lunch. I think its absolutely ridiculous that the school can't carb count his lunch. The lunch ladies MUST have the nutrional facts for the hot lunch. If they haven't figured it out, its on ALL boxes that are sent into the school. How hard is it for them to give the carb count, most lunch programs rotate the same menu through the year. How hard is it for the lunch staff, or whomever does Coopers stuff, to say, OK, he at 3 chicken nuggets, a half a slice of bread, a 1/2 cup of peaches, 1/2 cup green beans and his milk.. when the lunch is severed they use 1/2c- 1/4c-1/3c sevice scoops.. Its not hard to do, its part of basic D management. He shouldn't HAVE to bring in his lunch.. and still even if he DID bring in his lunch, someone would STILL have to carb count it.. he's only 5, you can't expect him to do that!
     
  10. sassypantz

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    I'm surprised it's that much of an issue--isn't the school district required to have the nutrional values of everything it serves available?

    Lunches were the first hurdle we had to face sending DD back to school, and I was happy to find the complete list online. We printed it, then use it to compare the menu options for the day and she decides what she wants before she goes to school. Granted, they don't always serve exactly what's planned, and not every single item is on the nutrition list, but it was still extremely helpful, especially since the names of some of the items don't really reveal very much about the ingredients... "Nacho Naturals"?

    Surely anyone competent enough to TEACH can look at a nutrition breakdown and figure out how many carbs the meal has, and give an educated guess about total carbs eaten if there is food leftover.
     
  11. Flutterby

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    but no matter what he's eating, it still needs to be counted, he's only 5. I thought for Kaylee to send in lunch w/ carb counts.. but she's only 6, and wouldn't be able to figure out how much she ate of each thing and figure out the carbs...so having a little one makes lunch more difficult in that it needs to be counted up at the end, reguardless.:)
     
  12. tom_ethansdad

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    My D son is not yet old enough to go to school where lunch is an issue, and the two older ones have always carried their own lunch to school so I don't anticipate any issues here, but in today's world where school cafeterias should be very focused on serving healthy lunches, I would not expect it to be asking too much that the school know the nutritional value of what they are serving. So it seems to me all someone would have to do is to take that info from the cafeteria and account for how much was actually eaten. That doesn't sound like cadillac care to me, but again I have no experience here.
     
  13. MamaChrissa

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    Carb counting is basic math and hardly a "cadillac" service. Gimme a break. Clearly this chick was talking out her you know what. She hasn't a clue! :rolleyes:
     
  14. Charliesmom

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    Ugghh, I hope Charlie doesn't mind doing sack lunch next year when he starts kindergarten.
    I think the hard part about counting the carbs with hot lunch is that they don't really measure servings, unless things have changed. Honestly, I don't know how much I will trust them to count anyway.
    I am so dreading next year... :rolleyes:
     
  15. jules12

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    I think it is crazy to say it is too much to ask the school - what about field trips, special snacks from the PTA, etc. If you are not reachable, the school has to know how to do basic carb counting.

    We have been known to have last minute substitutions, special "SURPRISE" snacks, etc. I try to be available for whatever situation comes up - but reality is that I am not always reachable. The nurse or someone has to be able to step in.
     
  16. Lindy

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    Hey you crazy people.... We provide a carb count on every cold lunch!! :D

    If there is a snack (b-day treat or other), than we depend on the school to be able to carb count for Cooper - if it's his snack day or b-day treat I provide the carb count. On a rare occasion he will eat hot lunch, and yes - I expect them to carb count that!

    Oops, haven't updated the profile... he's 7 now.

    Our endo wrote an AMAZING letter to the school explaining the basic care needed for ANY child with type 1, that was 2yrs ago. It covered counting carbs!

    I don't expect my 1st grader to know how many carbs are in certain food.... he's just starting to learn to read the nutritional label and will read off a number for carbs...he doesn't yet understand serving size or any of the other math involved in carb counting...

    Our ADA attorney is pulling together some information to send to the OCR that might explain carb counting and the necessity of it for Type 1's from a more neutral source...

    It always has to be a battle - I'm getting down because I'm always fighting for my child's rights!
     
  17. sassypantz

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    Having worked in all sorts of food service facilities, I can assure you that they DO measure servings. They may not be exact, but they are carefully measured and controlled in order to cut costs. Each scoop is color coded (older ones may only have a number engraved on them) and pre-planned for every dish. Any cafeteria that's having budget problems will attack portion control as the very first line of defense to control costs. In a school setting, I wouldn't worry that portions vary widely enough to greatly affect carb counting.
     
  18. Sarah Maddie's Mom

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    My overall attitude toward school and D is to try to anticipate all the points of potential screw up and mitigate those as much as possible in advance. When it comes to food and bolusing I think that's a pretty good opportunity for screw ups. Could be that the count is wrong (I've seem many instances of inaccurate carb counts on packaged foods just from out home kitchen) or perhaps that the portion size is off, or that the food doesn't look or taste so great once it's on the tray:rolleyes:.

    It has been MY decision that rather than risk other people making mistakes calculating carbs it would be easier, and safer to have Maddie bring her own food rather than count on one person to calculate the carbs, perhaps another to determine the portion size, then maybe a third to figure out how much food was there initially and how much food remains on the tray and then someone else to bolus for the meal already eaten. Like I said, this is MY feeling, but seeing how chaotic and rushed lunch period is (and ours is a well funded school in which the kids are relatively pampered) and the extent to which a messed up lunch bolus can wreck her numbers for the balance of the day it has seemed simpler to pack a lunch she likes and which she can be reliably expected to eat and for which she can be prebolused for.

    I never meant to suggest that a 5 year old should be counting his own carbs.:cwds:
     
    Last edited: Dec 7, 2009
  19. Sarah Maddie's Mom

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    Oh! For treats! :rolleyes:

    At 7 Madie would show it to the nurse and she'd estimate ( with Maddie's help) and the next year she and the teacher would estimate and if it was something really weird they'd call and we'd estimate together.

    Sorry - I didn't see in the OP that we were talking about treats :cwds: Sorry they're giving you grief :(
     
  20. Becky Stevens mom

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    We've always sent Stevens lunch in with him. There is unfortunately very little there that is fit to eat, full of fat, fast food type stuff. I did ask the lunch director for a list of carb counts so that we could figure out carbs if he did ever want hot lunch. I usually will send in a note with him if he is going to have hot lunch and let the nurse know how many carbs to bolus for.
     

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