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View Full Version : Can insulin needs decrease with a growth spurt



Lisa P.
01-20-2009, 10:39 AM
and with all other things being equal? (I.e. same or more carbs, but far less insulin)? Our recent round of lows the nurse asked if it was a growth spurt, frankly I thought that was a mistaken thing to say because I'd figure a growth spurt would mean more carbs and more insulin, not the same carbs and much less insulin. But we had a pediatrician appointment yesterday and I think she's grown from 24 to 27 pounds in the last few months. Any experience like that?

mmgirls
01-20-2009, 11:18 AM
We always seemed to need more insulin in the night and les in the day when she was younger. Also during teething I needed to give her motrin before bed to help with her night numbers. She would get real restless and wakeful durin growing phases and teething.

Jacob'sDad
01-20-2009, 11:19 AM
Good question but I don't know the answer.:(
Something is going on with Jacob the last several days. We have been fighting a lot of lows. I don't think he is getting sick.

StillMamamia
01-20-2009, 11:24 AM
YDMV:confused: I don't know.

BUT, if we have lows, then Ian needs less insulin to cover the same amount of carbs if he's a higher - meaning he's more insulin sensitive when he's had a string of lows. Whether this precedes or follows a growth spurt:confused: I don't know.

Of course, could just also mean I'm totally off on the basals too:o

Is Selah honeymooning? Maybe that affects how the growth hormones impact insulin response:confused:

Lisa...I DON'T KNOW...there I said it, but wanted to post, because I thought I had something going here:o

Good luck.

MamaC
01-20-2009, 11:25 AM
Lisa,

We have ALWAYS seen reduced insulin needs during growth spurts. Which reminds me, I need to get the yardstick out, as basals have been decreased by 50% and still need another downward tweak.

twodoor2
01-20-2009, 03:29 PM
Well, I don't know the true answer to your question. All I know is that when the last growth spurt occurred, her insulin needs doubled, then almost tripled. However, as she was coming out of the growth spurt, that's when the lows start appearing. Perhaps this is a case of coming out of a growth spurt?????

Nancy in VA
01-20-2009, 03:30 PM
I wish I could attribute Emma's lows to that. We have had such a decreased TDD that I'd love to attribute to growth but I doubt that's it for us

Lisa P.
01-20-2009, 03:45 PM
She roller coasters, so I guess it could be repeated growth spurts. It seems to be even and then dip, but her tdd does tend to be higher when she comes out of the dip. Hmm. Interesting to see it's a possibility, it seems completely opposite of what we should see, but I guess a lot of this stuff seems to go against common sense when you first come across it.

Lisa P.
01-20-2009, 03:47 PM
Lisa,

We have ALWAYS seen reduced insulin needs during growth spurts. Which reminds me, I need to get the yardstick out, as basals have been decreased by 50% and still need another downward tweak.

O.k., this is the second time Selah's pancreas' behavior seems to be mimicking Tom's. If she's still getting lows out of the blue when she's 16 years old, I'm blaming you and hunting you down. . . . .:cool:

wilf
01-20-2009, 08:47 PM
Growth hormone has the effect of raising BG. But coming off a growth spurt might be the issue, if you've previously raised insulin a bit to accommodate the higher insulin needs during the growth spurt. Once she stops growing, she's then getting too much insulin and goes low..

MamaC
01-20-2009, 08:56 PM
Growth hormone has the effect of raising BG. But coming off a growth spurt might be the issue, if you've previously raised insulin a bit to accommodate the higher insulin needs during the growth spurt. Once she stops growing, she's then getting too much insulin and goes low..

And this is where I need to stress, again, that YDMV applies. We have never had increased needs for insulin during growth spurts, only decreased. His growth spurts have always been almost visible in real time, even before D.

I know, I know, he's strange. No one should use our experience as anything but proof to a rule.

wilf
01-20-2009, 10:00 PM
And this is where I need to stress, again, that YDMV applies. We have never had increased needs for insulin during growth spurts, only decreased. His growth spurts have always been almost visible in real time, even before D.

I know, I know, he's strange. No one should use our experience as anything but proof to a rule.

Ok, so you've maybe got some extreme YDMV issue going on at your end.. :rolleyes:

But overall, there are several hormones that the body produces which have the effect of raising blood sugars:
- adrenaline
- glucagon
- cortisol
- growth hormone

It is no coincidence that these are the hormones that the body produces if our children go low, in an attempt to raise BG levels. It is the presence of these hormones that causes the "rebound" that we often observe after a low..

MamaC
01-20-2009, 10:04 PM
Ok, so you've maybe got some extreme YDMV issue going on at your end.. :rolleyes:


So it would seem LOL

TheFormerLantusFiend
01-20-2009, 10:05 PM
My endo says some people need lower levels of insulin temporarily every time there's a major hormonal change, even if long term the change will cause insulin resistance. He said that after a med of mine caused my insulin needs to fall to less than 10 units per day (and me weighing 55 kg back then), even though said med tends to cause insulin resistance.

Lisa P.
01-20-2009, 10:06 PM
Here's a question, although I'm not convincing myself so it's probably out there. Is it possible that a growth spurt "uses up" sugar in the liver, so the basal output in the days directly following a growth spurt really drops until it can get replenished? The only way hormones can raise bg is by taking glucose from the liver, etc., right?


I think I'm off on another yellow brick road. . .

kyleesmom
01-21-2009, 11:18 PM
We've been having this issue as well and I wondered the same thing. For about a week now Kylee has been running low. A few in the 40's, but mostly 70's and 80's and she has woken up under 100 almost every morning although she has been 150 at 1 am when I check her. We dropped the Lantus, have played with the ratios a little, and she is still running low. I have also noticed that she seems to be thinning out, her pants are baggy and her face is thinner. I know with previous growth spurts, she has put on weight and her insulin needs greatly increase, so much so that they are hard to keep up with. And then just as fast as it started, it stops again.

You just watch, now that I said that, shes going to run high :p

MamaC
01-21-2009, 11:20 PM
You just watch, now that I said that, shes going to run high :p

Trust me. We just got there too. No novolog for 4 days and now BAM! It's back!

mollgirl
01-22-2009, 05:53 AM
Funny thing Jason gained weight, has been running high and then out of nowhere his numbers are all under 100. Go figure. We see the endo today and we'll see what they say. I wonder if it is the start of a honeymoon,hmmm?

Kelly
01-22-2009, 07:38 AM
Anastacia's insulin requirements would go up and down like you would not believe. Only now are they increasing and staying on the increase. When she was diagnosed, she was only 8kg, she is now over double that... and we still had times of decreased insulin needs even though she has been constantly growing! :cool: